<Paivi> bye all!

<Jambalaya> stay Paivi

<Janet> this will be fun!

<Stampverb> sheesh, I prolly need chattiquette!

<Jambalaya> this is a class about getting along in chat

<Stampverb> Lemme go turn on radio show and do bio break... brb

<Janet> or "how to avoid the crawfish"

<Jambalaya> janets can't hide the mighty crawfish

<Paivi> sorry, it's midnight here and counting votes is almost finished...good night!

* MonkeyMom slinkd down in her chair

<Janet> (which I haven't learned yet)

<Janet> LOL

<Vyx> or the trout or the catfish or the salmon of retribution... lol...

* Jambalaya tosses the caps to Jambalaya

<cak> and don't forget the Unix manual

<Vyx> where was Paivi hailing from?

<Stampverb> or the pickerel

<Jambalaya> FINLAND

<Vyx> cool! and obviously some kind of election there?

<Janet> I slap with a rancid Texas steer, but I rarely slap cuz it's usually me needing the slapping.

<Vyx> that is sooo true, Janet. :)

<Janet> lol

<Jambalaya> OK, WE HAVE A LOT OF NEW FACES THIS CONVENTION

<Janet> and I've been hit so often with that danged Unix manual

<Jambalaya> AND OUR MAIN OBJECT IS TO HAVE FUN HERE

<Janet> (I'm good at that part)

<Jambalaya> WE ALL LOVE TO HAVE A GOOD TIME

<Jambalaya> BUT THERE IS A TIME AND A PLACE FOR EVERYTHING

<Vyx> yeah, when chat ain't fun we don't come back.

<Jambalaya> THE PLACE TO CHAT IS IN THIS ROOM

<Janet> Some of the teachers really like it more quiet when they teach, though.

<Janet> (and we LUV our teachers!)

<Jambalaya> CHATTING IN CLASS IS CONSIDERED VERY RUDE

<Tarotmama> brb

<Jambalaya> AND DISTRACTING

* MonkeyMom will sit across the room from patywak from now on

<Janet> unless the teacher begs you too. and even still she's gonna want you to aim for staying on topic

<cak> but some (not to mention any J names) enjoy some banter during class

<Janet> LOL

<Janet> some (not to mention any J names) will out and out ask if you've fallen asleep

<cak> lol

<Jambalaya> THIS IS TRUE, SOME TEACHERS (JANET FOR INSTANCE) LOVE A ROWDY CLASS

<Vyx> Yeah, I get sorta worried when I'm teaching if no one says anything for a long time.

<Janet> but it's a good idea to listen until the teacher asks for more feedback

<cak> I like when the teacher lets us know her/his preference.

<Jambalaya> BUT THERE ARE SO MANY DEGREES OF ROWDY<G>

<Janet> me too. i'm always getting in trouble for running my mouth

<Vyx> But I do like sideways questions held until I'm done teaching... otherwise my class will run overtime.

<Tarotmama> when I am learning a technique, it's hard to follow when there is a lot of chat, tho

<Jambalaya> WHAT WE NEED TO CONSIDER IS THAT MOST OF OUR TEACHERS PUT AN AWESOME AMOUNT OF WORK INTO DOING THESE CLASSES

<Stampverb> even when Cindy asked for no questions until she was done with each card last night, there were constant interruptions

<Jambalaya> AND THERE IS VERY LITTLE REWARD FOR THESE EFFORTS

<Vyx> Yeah, no kidding...

<Jambalaya> SO WHEN THE CLASS GETS OUT OF CONTROL, THE TEACHER FEELS UNAPPRECIATED

<Janet> just public adoration

<cak> sometimes when the teacher has to type a lot, I find the silence frightening--I do try to stay close to topic

<Jambalaya> OF COURSE, NOW SOME TEACHERS,

<Vyx> Cak, you are one of the best question askers I know.

<Janet> for sure!

<Jambalaya> JANET FORGIVE ME FOR USING YOU AS THE BAD EXAMPLE<G>

<Janet> HEY! I'm a good example!!

<Jambalaya> BUT SOME TEACHERS JUST ASK FOR TROUBLE<G>

<Janet> or at least a different example

<deb> lol

<cak> naw, just an example at the other end of the continuum

<Janet> and I like the give and take of discussion

<cak> Janet has enough on-line experience to control the room, I think

<Janet> but go for it. I can be the bad example<g>

<MonkeyMom> she isn't afraid to poke an eye

<cak> (when she's in control, that is)

<Jambalaya> NOW OF COURSE, IN THE CLASSES THAT ARE MEANT TO BE DISCUSSION, WELL THOSE ARE MUCH MORE CASUAL

<Stampverb> I think there is a big diff. between regular classes, when it's the old regulars, and conventions with 25 students, incl. many newcomers

<cak> I think that's why I love discussion classes

<Janet> (and when I'm not, it's bedlam)

<cak> I agree SV

<Vyx> way more casual, I don't know why you make me put on caps for discussion, lol.

<Janet> for sure, Verb!

<Jambalaya> YES, THE DISCUSSION CLASSES HAVE BEEN VERY SUCCESFUL

<Jambalaya> THINK I LEFT OUT AN S

<deb> vyx's was excellent

<deb> I learned lots today

<MonkeyMom> me too

<Janet> me too!

<Vyx> I did, too!

<Jambalaya> WE CAN ALL LEARN FROM EACH OTHER

<Janet> and I'm learning now

<cak> I think that sometimes all that extraneous chat can make the screen fly by and scare new ones to chat

<deb> yes it does cak

<cak> uh, ones new to chat

<deb> I've been gone for quite a while

<Vyx> Yeah, it does take practice to keep up, for sure.

<MonkeyMom> lots of quiet chatters

<deb> and I was shocked at how fast it flew by the other nite

<Stampverb> so, maybe during cons, there can be a designated "assistant" who periodically reiterates standard chattiquette rules -- in a way that does not point finger to one person

<deb> and I'm not new

<Janet> but that's disruptive, too. I do know when I know the teacher wants quiet, I'lll send a private message asking someone to hold the chatter

<Jambalaya> VERB, LAST NIGHT I HAD TO GET THE WHIP OUT<G> THEY WERE TOO ROWDY FOR THE CRAWFISH<G>

<Janet> and it's not personal and not calling on the carpet, just watching out for the teacher

<Stampverb> oooo

<deb> I used to have a teacher ask me to occasionally ask people to stay on topic

<cak> I'm a little uncomfortable with that because of it's hard for new ones to not feel like they're doing something wrong (since you just don't know what you're doing yet)

<Janet> YIKES! the whip! (I've felt the sting of that whip, too)

<deb> most of the time that worked

<Vyx> hiya Wezz!

<Jambalaya> HI WEZZ

<Stampverb> we should avoid saying Hi to all the late arrivals--then others all say hi, the latecomer says hi back -- ack!

<deb> hi wezz

<Janet> (Hi Wezz! we're talking chattiquette)

<cak> yeah, the asking of an on-topic question really can make a difference

<deb> I usually private my hi's

<Vyx> Yeah... I don't greet everyone ever. Hiya all when I get to a room, and that's it.

<Jambalaya> YES IN A FORMAL CLASS GREETING EVERYONE WHO COME IN LATE IS DISTRACTING

<deb> and I even private t he URL

<wezz> hey all

<deb> to latecomers

<Janet> (but always greet everybody when you're in this room and not in a class like this)

<Wanda> but do you think the teacher should greet everyone so they feel welcome????

<Stampverb> not really Wanda

<deb> not after she starts teacher

<Stampverb> not in a huge class anyweay

<Vyx> Greet everyone when you arrive.

<deb> teaching

<Vyx> and be done with it.

<Wanda> got it

<deb> but it's up to you

<Janet> Wanda, sometimes, or do a recap sentence so the late one knows "this is a class, sit down, shut up, you'll catch up if you concentrate"

<Jambalaya> WELL, I UNDERSTAND THE SENTIMENT, BUT IT OPENS THE ROOM TO THINK THEY ALL NEED TO SAY HI

<deb> if you are the teacher

<cak> I think it also might be dependent on how much material you have to cover too

<Vyx> some people will get their feelings hurt if no one says Hiya to them, but it gets too distracting.

<Wanda> like last night when I ran out of time

<Jambalaya> HI KYCrafter

<wezz> hi KY

<wezz> :p to all the rest....

<deb> hi KYCrafter

<Janet> LOL

<deb> we are just talking about etiquett in classes

<cak> Wanda, you covered it all. You covered the part that most people would have trouble with-important to set priorities

<Jambalaya> YES, WE TRY TO TIME THE CLASSES, BUT SOMETIMES THINGS HAVE TO BE EXPLAINED MORE, AND THE HOUR IS UP BEFORE WE KNOW IT

<Jambalaya> OH AND HERE'S ANOTHER PET PEEVE OF MINE<G>

<Wanda> k

<deb> ut oh

<MonkeyMom> MM was too stumped to disrupt Miss Wanda last night

<Jambalaya> CLASSES START ON THE HOUR

<Vyx> Yeah, talk to me about a 1 hour class that ended up running 3 hours. Not during convention, thank gosh.

<Janet> LOL Vyx

<deb> lol vyx

<KYCrafter> Hello y'all!

<Jambalaya> DON'T ACT SURPRISED WHEN YOU COME IN AT 20 AFTER AND THE CLASS HAS ALREADY STARTED WITHOUT YOU

<Janet> (and when I made that cane, I made enough to cover the dining room table, so that fit, too<g>)

<deb> what you didn't WAIT?

<cak> (lol--the nerve, eh?)

<deb> during a class I did one time - someone said - You started without me?

<Vyx> I know some of you will remember that. We kept having to go on and on and on and on sidetracked.

<Jambalaya> AND PLEASE DON'T EXPECT THE TEACHER TO REPEAT WHAT YOU MISSED

<Janet> LOL

<deb> uh yeah

<Jambalaya> IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN<G>

<Stampverb> that's why I am thinking a standard, abbreviated set of rules, at the start of the class and repeated occasionally, will help everyone get the point -- I volunteer to help do the wording, FWIW

<Stampverb> for the convention anyway

<deb> fwiw?

<Stampverb> for what its worth

<deb> oh lol

<Janet> but you can whisper to someone in the class and maybe they can catch you up, or you can always wait a day or two and read the log

<wezz> maybe you could have a document on the site that everyone can consult???

<Vyx> hehehe Janet. I was just talking about that the other day. what shoulda been golf ball sized ended up being softball sized

<Jambalaya> GOOD IDEA WEZZ

<Janet> that was mine<g>

<wezz> It could also include all the commands used in a class / chat

<Jambalaya> WE NEED A CHATIQUETTE PAGE

<deb> needs to be short and sweet

<wezz> coz I have to ask for them everytime, and can never remember them

<Jambalaya> I'LL WORK ON THAT AFTER THE CONVENTION

<Wanda> or put it at the to of the schedule

<Wanda> top

<MonkeyMom> me too wezz

<Stampverb> HEY! How about I run a statement (someone else help me write it of course)in the newsletter every day this week during convention?

<Jambalaya> GREAT VERB!

<Vyx> Yeah, a basic chatiquette page and rulez for classes. Hmm.

<wezz> that would be a great idea

<Vyx> needs to be one screen.

<Stampverb> I like the idea of a statement at the top of the schedule too

<deb> neds to be short and sweet

<Vyx> no paging down, but I'm sure we could fit it all in there.

<Jambalaya> EVERYONE SEND SUGGESTIONS TO STAMPVERB@DM.NET

<cak> needs to be way less than one screen! Most people won't show up if they think they're gonna be strictly controlled

<Jambalaya> FOR WHAT INFO YOU THINK WE NEED IN NEWSLETTER, AND ON A CHAT PAGE

<wezz> the commands needed, no saying hi to everyone when it's a class, etc... LOL

<deb> exactly cak

<Stampverb> ok, thanks--I'll do a first take for the update I send out in about 5 hours--so get yer ideas to me within 4 hours please

<Vyx> simple basics like "keep chatter to a minimum" plus maybe the 5 commands that Kriz teaches?

<Jambalaya> OK, ANY QUESTIONS?

<wezz> maybe a link to a page with the commands could work too?? Not everyone is gonna use them or even be interested

<Vyx> Yeah, I have one. How big have the classes been so far?

<Jambalaya> WE CAN HELP Y'ALL WITH HOW TO CHANGE ROOMS AND ANY OTHER QUESTIONS YOU HAVE

<cak> be sure to differentiate between during class and before after class though

<MonkeyMom> that would keep the rules page shorter

<wezz> yeah I think so

<Jambalaya> VYX, AROUND 25-27 IN MOST CLASSES

<Vyx> I know in the past we've done classes with famous people and just devoiced everyone during.

<cak> oh yeah, if you call it anything please call it a Guide not Rules

<Wanda> are those good numbers for convention

<wezz> really???? not when I'm around then!! Must be the middle of my nights then!!

<Stampverb> devoiced?

<Vyx> Yeah, no one can talk except the teacher and assistants.

<Jambalaya> YES, WE HAVE THE CAPABILITY TO MAKE THE ROOM QUIET, BUT WE DON'T WANT TO DO THAT

<Tarotmama> brb

<cak> only certain people can talk, although everyone can pm (private message)

<deb> there's only 2 people that I know of that didn't want any talking

<Vyx> You get a message when you get to class... that you aren't gonna be allowed to talk.

<Stampverb> yikes

<wezz> I think in a large numbered class this is necessary, especially since you only have one hour

<deb> it made the teacher nervous

<Jambalaya> OH ANOTHER THING, FOR YOU NEWBIES

<Jambalaya> ANYONE THAT HAS A CROWN, OR @ SYMBOLE BY THEIR NAME ON THE LIST AT RIGHT IS STAFF, AND CAN HELP YOU

<wezz> but I wouldn't want it if I were to teach though

<Tarotmama> janet, pm

<Stampverb> ok folks, I cannot log, so PLEASE send me your suggestions for a first take on class guide to go in newsletter tonight -- in the next 4 hours

<wezz> hey!! I didn't get a crown this year yet!!! How come??? Don't you guys like me as queen????? LOL

<Jambalaya> WEZZ IS NOT STAFF<G>

<wezz> :p

<cak> we've started only crowning 2-3 staff people each class. Keeps the confusion down

<Vyx> We don't give ops to everyone anymore, Wezz. Usually you'll only see 3 staffers op'd

<wezz> LOL

<wezz> I know, just kidding you all!!

<wezz> I am staff, ask Janet!! LOL

<Jambalaya> YA I JUST OPPED STAFF SO THEY CAN SEE WHO TO ASK QUESTIONS

<wezz> hehe

<Stampverb> I never get ops! and I am staff -- but I am on a Mac so I understand

<cak> deb too (emerita)

<Vyx> You can't even see when you do get op'd, Verb, lol

<Jambalaya> YA DEB IS STAFF EMERITUS

<Stampverb> i know

* deb is just halfstaff

<Jambalaya> AND VERB IS STAFF BUT CAN'T SEE OPS

<cak> poor verbie

<Stampverb> lol, the invisible crown I wear

<wezz> Is being on Mac so different then (asks the ignorant that never worked on a Mac before...)

<Stampverb> it's actually my ancient chat software, wezz

<cak> I think it's more a function of the irc chat program.

<cak> I'm on a Mac and I see who's been oped and who hasn't

<wezz> ha Verb, maybe that's even better!! An invisible crown for secret service!!!

<wezz> ROTFLOL!

<Stampverb> lol

<Jambalaya> OK, SO DO Y'ALL HAVE ANY QUESTIONS?

<Jambalaya> OR NEED HELP WITH ANYTHING ABOUT CHAT?

<wezz> but i'm in chat through an ancient program, and I can see who has ops??

<Vyx> Nope. :)

<Stampverb> yeah

<wezz> I don't have irc

<wezz> or mirc

<Janet> did we talk about how to send private messages?

<BC-away> hi, everyone

<deb> oh

<Stampverb> how to graciously tell someone to lighten up!

<Vyx> hiya Monica

<deb> never send private message that you wouldn't want someone in the room to read

<Vyx> lol, Deb

<Janet> no kidding!!!

<cak> lol

<deb> : )

<deb> JUST in case it doesn't work

<Jambalaya> IN ALMOST ALL PROGRAMS, YOU JUST HIGHLIGHT AND DOUBLE CLICK ON A PERSONS NAME TO PRIVATE MESSAGE THEM

<Janet> (I've done this. More than once. It's not fun for anyone concerned.)

<deb> me too

<cak> we've all been there, for sure

<Janet> my latest was goofing up on a comment about someone else's sex life

<wezz> uh, yeah, me too, since I never can remember the correct ways or commands

<Vyx> yep. it's really bad when you are staff and do that.

<wezz> LOL

<Janet> i wanted to DIE

<deb> lol

<deb> me too janet

<Janet> (but at least she HAD one)

<deb> lol

<wezz> sex life Janet??? Aren't you a bit too curious???? hmmmmm??????? LOLOL

<Janet> it's always good to have a friend to chatter with during a class, for those comments you just can't hold in!

<Janet> lol

<Janet> she told ME

<deb> lol

<Janet> I didn't wanna hear, it just makes me jealous<g>

<Jambalaya> YA JUST MAKE SURE WHICH WINDOW YOU TYPE IN<G>

<cak> lol

<deb> yeah - I usually make a private window

<wezz> see?? change that setting from your name to "afk"... I don't know how to do that, and if you tell me now, I'll still have to ask for that tomorrow again...

<deb> learned the hard way

<Janet> LOL

<Stampverb> I really have to be careful--PMs are in the SAME window as rest of chat

<Janet> wezz, it's /nick (new nick)

<Janet> so /nic wezz-afk

<Jambalaya> TYPE THIS WEZZ: /nick Pest

<wezz> okay, I can ask you this again tomorrow, right????? LOL

<Janet> or /nic wezz-gettinganothergreatbelgianbeer

<wezz> pest??

<Stampverb> try it now wezz

<cak> I used to have them display that way too SV, askin' for trouble (especially if you have to take 'em out to post the log)

<Vyx> lol

<wezz> LOL Janet!!

<Jambalaya> lol

<Janet> sure! I'm always good for repeating a command. it makes me feel smart<g>

<deb> yeah!!

<Weasel> hey, that worked!!

<Jambalaya> lol

<Janet> YAY!!!

Log file closed at: 10/24/04 5:03:41 PM